Response to OP about a just deceased fundamentalist pastor in San Diego who had a video series: "7 reasons why Barack Obama is not a Christian"; I have personally met the person who posted the OP
Jesus says: "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the father but by me." (John 14:6)
If this means what it seems to mean then it means that a person's "salvation" and eternal destiny are a matter of making a lucky guess. If a person happens to guess correctly by "accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior", then that person is "saved" and goes to heaven. However a person who guesses wrong by adhering to a religion other than Christianity is condemned to hell for all eternity...
My thoughts about my having pointed out that a poster who had made a very unkind comment about a seven-year-old boy's paintings was a fundamentalist Christian
I have been thinking about this, and I do have to take seriously the charges of bigotry and a double standard. I think I have some things to say about this.
First of all, in regard to what Zeb said:
Or if the post had been by an Atheist, and someone said: "Just so everyone knows, this poster is an unbeliever."
Actually if the boy's paintings had a religious theme, or were religious in nature, and someone known to be an atheist had made a derogatory comment similar to what Zeb made about the ...
Response to post regarding homosexuality: Don't be fooled by the religious veneer; it's simple bigotry.
A lot of people register a disgust response to their first encounter of the idea of homosexuality, and they take that initial feeling to mean something important. They make biological arguments, as in "that's not how nature intended it" etc. But when it comes right down to it, it's not really a moral judgment they're making, but an aesthetic one, as in, "that's gross."
I myself am definitely heterosexual; I am not gay and am not bi. I am a male whose sexual attractions have always been toward ...
Response to OP: Exercise: Improve the Ten Commandments
and replace it with a commandment to parents to "treat your children with dignity and respect, that they may come to treat others with dignity and respect."
I say this as a former Christian, and as one who had a very difficult relationship with my father.
My dad did many very good things and many very nice things, and I had many good times with him. He was far from being the worst father anybody ever had. Even so he sometimes behaved in ways that bordered on being abusive.
Oftentimes if I m...
Response to post by DU's resident fundamentalist Christian: Those 66% are wrong. The Bible is fully consistent with 66% of the people rejecting "God's Word".
I.e. 66% of the world's population will be condemned to hell for all eternity because they happen to make the incorrect guess that the Bible is not the "Word of God", according to Zebedeo. Either they happen to make the incorrect guess that some other book, such as the Koran, rather than the Bible, is the "true revelation from Allah (God)", or they do not regard any alleged revelation from God as actually being such.
Zeb's God is an arbitrary, evil, and despicable tyrant like Hitler or Stalin ...
Response to OP: Long-time DU members with low post counts check in here
I joined DU in April 2002 and made my first post in May 2002, and have just recently (this past September) made my 1000th post here. It took me just a little less than 7 1/2 years to make 1000 posts.
I am by nature not an outgoing person, and am more of an introvert than an extrovert. This is true both in real life and in a discussion board like this. I am particularly not given to small talk or banter of the kind seen in the DU lounge, again either in a place like the lounge or in real life...
My contribution to California Peggy Appreciation Thread
I have had the pleasure of meeting California Peggy a couple of times at SoCal DU meetups.
We need to have another SoCal DU gathering.
California Peggy is a very gracious woman. California Peggy, :yourock:
Response to OP: You have one chance (one question/statement) to make an R/T opponent change his/her mind. What would you do with that chance?
I might say what I think about a particular topic or matter, and if what I say influences someone else to do some thinking, great. If not, no problem.
Incidentally that is one of the nice things about not being a Christian, particularly not being a fundamentalist Christian like Zebedeo. A fundamentalist Christian has on his or her mind the thought that other people are going to go to hell for all eternity if they happen to not "accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior" in this lifetime. I just...
Response to OP: CONFESS!!!!! What is the weirdest request a date every asked of you??
I myself have always had a liking for body hair on women, particularly unshaven or hairy legs. I have always had a wish that women, in non-trivial numbers, would let their body hair grow out, and feel OK about doing so.
I certainly do not think it is weird to like body hair on women, any more than it is to be gay or lesbian. If it is now generally accepted by most of mainstream society that it is normal and OK to be attracted to people of the same sex, then why should it be any different to b...
Thanks to Strong Atheist for his ********MILESTONES******* post, in which he acknowledges my 1000 post milestone
Thanks very much, Strong Atheist, for taking over the work of newyawker99.
I now finally have 1000 posts after having posted here since May 2002. Thanks for the acknowledgment.
I understand about your life being stressful and hectic. I myself am now taking a couple of classes at my local community college, and have started working on a project for some people that might possibly be turning into a job. These have to take precedence over posting on DU. There are some recent threads in the Re...
Response to WilliamPitt's OP: So I'm getting married this weekend...
Congratulations and best wishes to both you and your bride.
:toast:
I heard once that two printer color inkjet cartridges got married. A short time later the bride said excitedly to her groom, "Darling, I think I'm pigment."
Response to madfloridian's OP: Odd duo worked together to form faith-based prisons..Doug Coe and Chuck Colson.
And I still have the book (more for historical interest than for any other reason).
At the time I first read the book Born Again I was serious about Christianity, and had “accepted Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior”, in the hopes that doing so might make some kind of difference in my life. I wanted to believe that maybe Chuck Colson was an example of somebody being changed by Christ, that Christ was working through Chuck Colson, and was transforming him from a scoundrel into somebody who was bec...
Happy 85th birthday.
Happy birthday to probably the most truly good person to hold the office of President of the United States, certainly in recent times.
A Christian in the best sense of the word.
A Choice Between Two Futures in 1980. America has been much the worse for the choice made that year.
Response to OP: How many degrees of separation do you have with a famous person?
I knew Robert Zoellick. I did much of my growing up in Naperville, Illinois, and lived there most of the 1960's. Robert Zoellick lived just half a block from where I lived. I knew Robert Zoellick, his older brother, and his mother. I was 3 years ahead of Robert in school, and his older brother was one year ahead of me.
Naperville, in Dupage County, has always been very Republican and conservative. I remember a lot of people were for Barry Goldwater in 1964. Though back in the 1960's there...
Response to OP: What unconventional physical traits do you find attractive in someone?
I particularly like a woman who is otherwise attractive, and who has some serious body hair (i.e. more than just a little), and who lets her body hair grow out, and who likes and is not ashamed of her natural state and her natural hair. I find such a woman to be very sexy. I particularly like hairy or unshaven legs on a woman, but I also like body hair elsewhere on a woman.
I have had a liking for body hair on women since I was an adolescent.
I think it is crazy, and really a crime, that wom...
Response to OP by a DUer whom I have met: How many people have been on DU since before 2003?
I joined DU in April 2002, and made my first post on May 1, 2002. Here is a recent post in which I linked to my very first DU post (as requested by the OP to which my post was a response), and also to a pun thread in early 2003 in which I had posted a number of puns (I like puns).
(Link)
I finally have 1000 posts after just a little less than 7 1/2 years. I am not one of the most prolific posters. I am not a naturally gregarious or outgoing person, either in real life or on a forum like thi...
Response to OP: Rachel Maddow: ASTOUNDING Final Moments of Her Interview of Tom Ridge (Note: I think the whitespace is due to this post being in the Videos forum)
I had a friend who voted for Bush in 2004, felt that what we were doing in Iraq was the right thing for us to do, and said that he was not bothered that we did not find any of the weapons of mass destruction because, as he pointed out, intelligence is not an exact science.
This was a friend whom I met at one of my jobs in the mid 1970's when we were both students, and working under a special program sponsored by our university. He was a fundamentalist Christian, but did not fit the worst stere...
Response to OP: How tall are you? Are you happy with your height?
And yes I am happy with my height.
It is a gruesome story how I came to be tall; I was once a little boy, and then I grew some.
Actually in high school I was very unathletic and very poor at sports, especially team sports. So I always hated it very much when somebody would ask me if I played basketball. I still have never come to like or enjoy team sports, but I started running to be in shape when I was in college, and I am still doing that, even at age 58.
I have been a member of the San D...
Response to OP: Where were you during the Moon Walk, besides glued to a T-V?
I was in summer school at North Central College in Naperville, Illinois at the time of the first moonwalk. This was between my freshman and sophomore years at college, and I was taking a couple of classes, and living in the dorm (my parents were living in Michigan at the time).
I made the comment that it was out of this world.
Response to OP: Where were you on 7 Jul 1977? (i.e. 7/7/77)
I was working at my very first full time job, which was as a Civil Service GS-5 (entry level) job as a Mathematician at Edwards Air Force Base in California, and living in the town of Lancaster. I had been working there for almost a year on that date (my one year anniversary was July 19).
I wouldn't recall what I was doing on that particular date. (Oddly enough I had not noticed or though of at the time that there was anything significant about the date, or the numbers associated with the dat...
Response to OP: Post words of wisdom (not!) you learned from a parent.
My dad would often say this to me when I was a young man if I were angry or upset with him or with something he said or did.
As if "being independent" were that simple and easy, and as if I wasn't going through any major struggles. Or as if, because he was helping me out, that he could do no wrong, and that I had no right to object to anything he said or did.
Response to OP by Time for change: “Drapetomania”, “Communism”, and “Terrorism” in the Service of Class War, which had quote by Noam Chomsky explaining the psychology behind the propensity of people to justify their own cruelty
This is true whether justifying imperialism or slavery, as indicated in the Chomsky quote in your post, or whether justifying abuse or mistreatment of children.
The Swiss writer and psychotherapist has written a book, now online, titled , with subtitle “Hidden Cruelty in Child-Rearing and the Roots of Violence”. Her book documents horrendous child-rearing practices advocated in child-rearing manuals of past centuries. These include manuals that were written and used in Germany in the late 1...
Response to OP: Why did you have (or not have) children?
One of the circumstances is that for various reasons, including some problems that I had when I was young, but also due to some choices I have made as an adult, I have so far not had any serious relationship with a woman. This is admittedly one of the biggest disappointments of my life. (I am a 58 year old heterosexual male.)
However I am not at all disappointed that I do not have children.
First of all I had a very difficult and unhappy childhood and adolescence, and it was a struggle for m...
Response to OP: Post a link to your earliest post on DU!
(Link)
Right now when I click on the links to any of the forums I get a script error.
Here is a link to a pun thread on the old board from 2003, shortly before the new board was implemented, in which I posted a few puns.
(Link)
Sometimes this link works, and at other times I get a script error. I am right now getting a script error.
I joined DU in April 2002, and I made my first post on May 1, 2002. I have been able to find it in the past, when I have been able to link to the forums.
On...
Response to OP: Anyone here see (the movie) "Christiane F."? Was it any good?
The Swiss writer and psychotherapist Alice Miller, in her now online book , has (along with a chapter about Hitler and a chapter about a child molester and murderer).
Each case she presents as an example of how severe abuse and mistreatment in childhood has led the person to be either self-destructive or destructive toward others.
The phrase "For Your Own Good" was one my father very often used. I had a very difficult father, who did some very good things but who also at times bordered on be...
Response to OP: Nobody in DU believes in anything after this life? That's cool, but I just want to know, for my own sanity. There is nothing after this? Something? Is this as good as it is going to get? What think you?
My personal feeling has been that if there is anything at all to our sense of justice and fairness, and value and meaning of life, then there just has to be something after this present life. And I find very depressing the thought that after I, or anyone else, dies, that is it, there is nothing afterward, and no hope of justice for a person who receives the bad breaks in this life.
And I hate to think that all our good gifts and our experiences and our qualities of character are of value only f...
Response to Time for change's OP: Excessive Obedience to Authority
I indicated in a about the Swiss writer and psychotherapist , and her documentation of childhood abuse and mistreatment, and the long term effects of such abuse and mistreatment. She documents, for instance, that excessive obedience to authority is something that is learned in childhood, and is a natural result of childhood mistreatment, and fear of offending or displeasing one’s parents (or caretakers).
According to Alice Miller, it is essential for both individuals and society as a whole t...
Response to OP: A Solidarity thread for straights upset by Proposition 8
I don't know whether to be more upset about the ruling today or the fact that it was passed in the first place back in November.
I am angry about the religious people who feel, based on their religious beliefs, that it is their damned business to decide that a certain group of people are to be denied certain rights that other people enjoy. There were a lot of Yes on 8 signs on people's yards in my neighborhood, and sometimes not on anybody's property, right before the November election. I did...
Response to OP in which was the question: If you used to believe but don't no longer, how did that happen?
I am sorry to hear about your marital troubles and your divorce, k4d. I am glad that your faith is of help to you. Hugs to you. :hug: :hug:
I myself used to be a Christian; I no longer am because I came to the realization that being a Christian, and supposedly having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, had been of no help to me in enabling me to deal with anything that was a source of personal pain, frustration, or unhappiness in my life.
The biggest problem I had for which I found Ch...
What point is there for us today in learning about Hitler and his history? For me, the main point is this: our knowledge will serve as a warning against our blindness and encourage us to give it up once and for all and to struggle against collective repression. This is what I do consistently in all my books in order to help people understand the psychodynamics of the mistreatment of children and its immeasurable danger for society, as demonstrated by Hitler's case. My explanations are by no means intended to suggest pity for a man as merciless as Hitler.
it was in large part owing to Hitler and his history that I became aware of the dangers of our traditional morality. We are exhorted to honor our parents and never question them no matter what they have done. Yet when I realize that millions of human beings had to die so that Adolf Hitler could keep his repression of childhood trauma intact, that millions were subjected to humiliation in concentration camps so that he never had to recognize how he had once been humiliated, then I believe that one can't point out these connections often enough in order to shed light on this unconscious production of evil. How should young people be expected to recognize and reject inhumanity and crime if these continue to be disguised instead of being pointed out as plainly as possible? Only when young people are permitted to know exactly what happened and how it could happen, only if they don't allow anything to stifle their curiosity and are not afraid of the truth, can they free themselves from the burden placed upon them by their forebears' blindness.
The "Final Solution", Adaptation to Society's Norms, Morality and Duty, and Childhood Feelings
People with any sensitivity cannot be turned into mass murderers overnight. But the men and women who carried out "the final solution" did not let their feelings stand in their way for the simple reason that they had been raised from infancy not to have any feelings of their own but to experience their parents' wishes as their own. These were people who, as children, had been proud of being tough and not crying, of carrying out all their duties "gladly," of not being afraid--that is, at bottom, of not having an inner life at all.
...
This perfect adaptation to society's norms--in other words, to what is called "healthy normality"--carries with it the danger that such a person can be used for practically any purpopse. It is not a loss of autonomy that occurs here, hbecause this autonomy never existed, but a switching of values, which in themselves are of no importance anyway for the person in question as long as his whole value system is dominated by the principle of obedience. He has never gone beyond the stage of idealizing his parents with their demands for unquestioning obedience; this idealization can iasily be transferred to a Führer or to an ideaology. Since authoritarian parents are always right, there is no need for their children to rack their brains in each case to determine whether what is demanded of them is right or not. And how is this to be judged? Where are the standards supposed to come from if someone has always been told what was right and what was wrong and if he never had an opportunity to become familiar with his own feelings and if, beyond that, attempts at criticism were unacceptable to the parents and thus were too threatening for the child? If an adult has not developed a mind of his own, then he will find himself at the mercy of the authorities for better or worse, just as an infant finds itself at the mercy of its parents. Saying no to those more powerful will always seem too threatening to him.
...
Morality and performance of duty are artificial measures that become necessary when something essential is lacking. The more successfully a person was denied access to his or her feelings in childhood, the larger the arsenal of intellectual weapons and the supply of moral prostheses has to be, because morality and a sense of duty are not sources of strength or fruitful soil for genuine affection. Blood does not flow in artificial limbs; they are for sale and can serve many masters. What was considered good yesterday can--depending on the decree of government of party--be considered evil and corrupt today, and vice versa. But those who have spontaneous feelings can only be themselves. They have no other choice if they want to remain true to themselves. Rejection, ostracism, loss of love, and name calling will not fail to affect them; they will suffer as a result and will dread them, but once they have found their authentic self they will not want to lose it. And when they sense that something is being demanded of them to which their whole being says no, they cannot do it. They simply cannot.
In the lives of all the tyrants I examined, I found without exception paranoid trains of thought bound up with their biographies in early childhood and the repression of the experiences they had been through. Mao had been regularly whipped by his father and later sent 30 million people to their deaths, but he hardly ever admitted the full extent of the rage he must have felt toward his own father, a very severe teacher who had tried through beatings to "make a man" out of his son. Stalin caused millions to suffer and die because even at the height of his power his actions were determined by unconscious infantile fear of powerlessness. Apparently his father, a poor cobbler from Georgia, attempted to drown his frustration with liquor and whipped his son almost every day. His mother displayed psychotic traits, was completely incapable of defending her son and was usually away from home either praying in church or running the priest's household. Stalin idealized his parents right up to the end of his life and was constantly haunted by the fear of dangers that had long since ceased to exist but were still present in his deranged mind. The same might be true of many other tyrants. The groups of people they singled out for persecution and the rationalization mechanisms they employed were different in each case, but the fundamental reason behind it was probably identical. They often drew on ideologies to disguise the truth and their own paranoia. And the masses chimed in enthusiastically because they were unaware of the real motives, including those operative in their own biographies. The infantile revenge fantasies of individuals would be of no account if society did not regularly show such naive alacrity in helping to make them come true.